Dice from each powerset tweak

[Battlechimp]

So, there's the whole two powersets being way better then one powerset deal (which I may or may not entirely agree with) and/or how it leads to grubbing for dice to cram both in on any given action (which I may or may not entirely agree with). And this has led some folks to deciding to just allow 2 dice from any combination of powers, which I don't really like cause it sort of mucks with multipower and/or versatile.

So I was thinking... What if the second powerset die was treated as an asset. Not one you have to roll for, but treated as in the same category.

Thus you'd get for free:

1 Affiliation
1 Distinction (ignoring the suggested house rule atm)
1 Power
1 Asset (or second Power)
1 Resource, or Push/Stunt die (if purchased)
1 Complication
1 Stress.

It gives two powerset heroes a leg up, but 1 powerset heroes can catch-up by generating an asset and two powerset heroes have to then decide on using an asset or using a second power.

So basically Wolverine is still going to be better off having Colossus throw him in a fast ball special, especially if Colossus can generate a d10 or higher effect.

I also sort of feel like moving Resources either to it's own group OR moving it over to the Asset category. Mainly because using a resource and a stunt seems to cost double the PP which I find a bit odd. And secondly because it conceptually seems to occupy the same narrative space that an Asset would, it's just less effective but longer lasting.

Thoughts? Any unforeseen side effects I'm overlooking?

[Cam]

That's a very clever suggestion!

Cheers,
Cam

[Supplanter]

1. Cool.
2. As it happens, you skipped Specialties.
3. BUT, that offers another potential tweak:

[INDENT]
1 Affiliation
1 Distinction (ignoring the suggested house rule atm)
1 Power
1 Specialty
1 Asset (OR second Power OR second Specialty)
1 Resource, or Push/Stunt die (if purchased)
1 Complication
1 Stress.
[/INDENT]

This let's the "highly trained" folks dine out on being highly trained.

One question: your original list says "second power." Do you mean second power set?

Thanks,


Jim

[Battlechimp]

One question: your original list says "second power." Do you mean second power set?

First, DOH! I forgot Specialties.

Second, yeah I intended that to read second power set power. Though it more properly would read Additional Power Set Power, thus folks who have 3+ power sets are still only pulling 1 additional free die. That would help further nip that problem in the bud as well.

EDITED TO ADD IN: Personally I conceptually like how powers are compartmentalized into power sets so one from A and one from B really works for me. I also like that it serves to highlight how one power set is main thrust in an action and the second power set is playing the assist. I further like it because Wolverines Claws, Cap's Shield, Spidy's Webshooters really are like Assets for them and while the Hulk or Thing doesn't have a second power set they can make their own by grabbing a lamp post and then BAM they have a second power set of "This big huge heavy thing I just ripped out of the ground to hit you in the face with".

Third, I'm on the fence of putting a second specialty in that slot. The idea does have some merit so I'm mulling it around.

[EldritchFire]

So, there's the whole two powersets being way better then one powerset deal (which I may or may not entirely agree with) and/or how it leads to grubbing for dice to cram both in on any given action (which I may or may not entirely agree with). And this has led some folks to deciding to just allow 2 dice from any combination of powers, which I don't really like cause it sort of mucks with multipower and/or versatile.

So I was thinking... What if the second powerset die was treated as an asset. Not one you have to roll for, but treated as in the same category.

Thus you'd get for free:

1 Affiliation
1 Distinction (ignoring the suggested house rule atm)
1 Power
1 Asset (or second Power)
1 Resource, or Push/Stunt die (if purchased)
1 Complication
1 Stress.

It gives two powerset heroes a leg up, but 1 powerset heroes can catch-up by generating an asset and two powerset heroes have to then decide on using an asset or using a second power.

So basically Wolverine is still going to be better off having Colossus throw him in a fast ball special, especially if Colossus can generate a d10 or higher effect.

I also sort of feel like moving Resources either to it's own group OR moving it over to the Asset category. Mainly because using a resource and a stunt seems to cost double the PP which I find a bit odd. And secondly because it conceptually seems to occupy the same narrative space that an Asset would, it's just less effective but longer lasting.

Thoughts? Any unforeseen side effects I'm overlooking?

I've been going back and forth on the push, stunt or resource thing, but I think it works well as-is. Stunting effectively steps up your resource die for an expert specialty, and is a "pre-paid" stunt for master specialties.

Other than that, I really like your idea! it's pretty cool. A second power set is usually going to be better than an asset, but some one like Hulk or The Thing who can easily generate a d10 or d12 effect die isn't going to miss it!

-EF

[Newtsy]

Sounds interesting.

So, for those one power set types ... how is the size of the "free" Asset die determined?

[Cam]

I'm assuming that's a free asset when one is available.

Cheers,
Cam

[Battlechimp]

I'm assuming that's a free asset when one is available.

Yeah, that's my intent.

If you have one power set you're only getting 1 die from powers at no PP cost. If you generate an Asset from somewhere you can then add it in at no PP cost and be using 2 dice. This is effectively the way the rules works as written.

If you have two power sets you're getting 2 dice from your powers at no PP cost. If you then generate an Asset from somewhere you have to pick between adding it or your second power set power in for free. You could however use 3 dice by spending a PP. This is the change in the rules - Second Power Sets take the same "slot" that Assets occupy.

Further random musings...

Since a lot of two power set heroes tend to have d8's and d10's they're kind of equaling out to decent Assets and don't gain much advantage if you give them a lower rated Asset. However, it does give them more narrative room to operate, and from a system angle more options when it comes to spending PP's. Also handy when one of your power sets is shut down.

So it also models why characters like Wolverine, Cap, Spidey, Daredevil, and similar don't tend pick up random bits of scenery to smack people with until they've lost their bonus widgets... they're getting better dice from their 2 powers so that extra d6 or d8 doesn't help them much. But someone like Luke Cage only has 1 power so he's going to grab a pipe or small building to thump you with. Now if they come up with some brilliant plan Asset or some wiz bang piece of tech Asset or have a giant metal Russian throwing them Asset then they use THAT instead because it's better.

[Reinhardt75]

Really is quite a neat way to balance out that power set. It is one of the things I was curious about game balance. Considering some of the single power set heroes can often "defeat" some of their multiple power set colleagues, I was wondering how the game mechanic could show this.

This would certainly be one way to balance that.

[Newtsy]

If you have two power sets you're getting 2 dice from your powers at no PP cost. If you then generate an Asset from somewhere you have to pick between adding it or your second power set power in for free.

I apologize if my brain isn't working "outside the box" here, but once an Asset is already established isn't it "free" for use by anyone(if narrative allows) already?